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toward a clearer understanding of reality
the rev’s faves
The Age of Reason
Thomas Paine
Some Mistakes of Moses
Robert Ingersoll
The God Delusion
Richard Dawkins
The Demon Haunted World
Carl Sagan
Awareness
Thomas Paine
Some Mistakes of Moses
Robert Ingersoll
The God Delusion
Richard Dawkins
The Demon Haunted World
Carl Sagan
Awareness
Anthony deMello
Breaking the Spell
Daniel C. Dennett
Freethought Across the Centuries
Gerald A. Larue
The Sins of Scripture
John Spong
Jesus for the Non Religious
Daniel C. Dennett
Freethought Across the Centuries
Gerald A. Larue
The Sins of Scripture
John Spong
Jesus for the Non Religious
John Spong
Doubt
Jennifer Michael Hecht
The Atheist’s Way: Living Well Without Gods
Jennifer Michael Hecht
The Atheist’s Way: Living Well Without Gods
Eric Maisel
Atheist Universe
David Mills
Atheism: The Case Against God
George H. Smith
Natural Atheism
David Eller
David Mills
Atheism: The Case Against God
George H. Smith
Natural Atheism
David Eller
Atheist Manifesto
Michel Onfray
A History of God
Karen Armstrong
A History of God
Karen Armstrong
The Spiral Staircase
Karen Armstrong
The End of Faith
Sam Harris
Letter to a Christian Nation
Sam Harris
Ishmael
Daniel Quinn
A Short History of Nearly Everything
Bill Bryson
The Guru Papers: Masks of Authoritarian Power
Joel Kramer & Diana Alstad
God is Not Great
Christopher Hitchens
50 Reasons People Give for Believing in God
The End of Faith
Sam Harris
Letter to a Christian Nation
Sam Harris
Ishmael
Daniel Quinn
A Short History of Nearly Everything
Bill Bryson
The Guru Papers: Masks of Authoritarian Power
Joel Kramer & Diana Alstad
God is Not Great
Christopher Hitchens
50 Reasons People Give for Believing in God
Guy P. Harrison
Being Peace
Thich Nhat Hanh
The Miracle of Mindfulness
Thich Nhat Hanh
The Reason Driven Life
Robert Price
The Conquest of Happiness
Bertrand Russell
Ken’s Guide to the Bible
Ken Smith
Losing Faith in Faith
Dan Barker
Thich Nhat Hanh
The Miracle of Mindfulness
Thich Nhat Hanh
The Reason Driven Life
Robert Price
The Conquest of Happiness
Bertrand Russell
Ken’s Guide to the Bible
Ken Smith
Losing Faith in Faith
Dan Barker
Godless
Dan Barker
Pagan Christs
J.M. Robertson
Treatise on the Gods
H.L. Mencken
The Christ Conspiracy
Acharya S.
The Jesus Mysteries Was the original Jesus a Pagan God?
Timothy Freke & Peter Gandy
The Road Less Traveled
Scott Peck
Is Belief in God Good, Bad or Irrelevant
Edited by Preston Jones
Godless (age 12 and up)
Pete Hautman
Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance
Robert M. Pirsig
How We Believe: The Search for God in an Age of Science
Michael Shermer
Religion Explained
Pascal Boyer
The Hero’s Journey
Joseph Campbell
The True Believer
Eric Hoffer
Holy Horrors
James Haught
Pagan Christs
J.M. Robertson
Treatise on the Gods
H.L. Mencken
The Christ Conspiracy
Acharya S.
The Jesus Mysteries Was the original Jesus a Pagan God?
Timothy Freke & Peter Gandy
The Road Less Traveled
Scott Peck
Is Belief in God Good, Bad or Irrelevant
Edited by Preston Jones
Godless (age 12 and up)
Pete Hautman
Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance
Robert M. Pirsig
How We Believe: The Search for God in an Age of Science
Michael Shermer
Religion Explained
Pascal Boyer
The Hero’s Journey
Joseph Campbell
The True Believer
Eric Hoffer
Holy Horrors
James Haught
Crazy for God
Frank Schaeffer
Your Inner Fish
Neil Shubin
A Guide to the Good Life:
the ancient art of stoic joy
William B. Irvine
This is Water
David Foster Wallace
Nickel and Dimed
Barbara Ehrenreich
links to enlightenment
10 reasons christianity is toxic
10 reasons Christianity is toxic
1. Christianity is INHERENTLY DIVISIVE as believers are promised eternal bliss and nonbelievers eternal torture.
2. Christianity INDUCES UNWARRANTED GUILT AND FEAR by asserting that a Cosmic Judge watches one’s every move and knows one’s every thought.
3. Christianity OBSCURES TRUTH AND PROMOTES FALSEHOODS by diverting focus from the natural (real) to the supernatural (unreal).
4. Christianity DEBASES HUMANITY by condemning us as sinners worthy of eternal damnation.
5. Christianity BREEDS A FALSE SENSE OF IMPORTANCE by asserting that The King of the Universe knew each of us intimately before we were born, knows the numbers of hairs on our head, has a special plan for us, loves us, watches us, listens to our every word, desperately wants a personal relationship with us and even promises to give us anything we ask for (Mt 21.22).
6. Christianity’s assertion that the Devil is real ALLOWS FOR THE LITERAL DEMONIZING of others.
7. Christianity PROVIDES THE ULTIMATE JUSTIFICATION FOR EVILS of all kinds (such as the vilifying of homosexuals and the subjection of women).
8. Christianity’s THREAT OF HELL HARDENS HEARTS and causes others mental anguish.
9. Christianity PROVIDES COVER FOR ABUSES OF ALL KINDS as evidenced by thousands of sexual abuse cases in the last few years alone.
10. Christianity LEGITIMIZES FRAUD as evidenced by countless insincere televangelists and church leaders.
1. Christianity is INHERENTLY DIVISIVE as believers are promised eternal bliss and nonbelievers eternal torture.
2. Christianity INDUCES UNWARRANTED GUILT AND FEAR by asserting that a Cosmic Judge watches one’s every move and knows one’s every thought.
3. Christianity OBSCURES TRUTH AND PROMOTES FALSEHOODS by diverting focus from the natural (real) to the supernatural (unreal).
4. Christianity DEBASES HUMANITY by condemning us as sinners worthy of eternal damnation.
5. Christianity BREEDS A FALSE SENSE OF IMPORTANCE by asserting that The King of the Universe knew each of us intimately before we were born, knows the numbers of hairs on our head, has a special plan for us, loves us, watches us, listens to our every word, desperately wants a personal relationship with us and even promises to give us anything we ask for (Mt 21.22).
6. Christianity’s assertion that the Devil is real ALLOWS FOR THE LITERAL DEMONIZING of others.
7. Christianity PROVIDES THE ULTIMATE JUSTIFICATION FOR EVILS of all kinds (such as the vilifying of homosexuals and the subjection of women).
8. Christianity’s THREAT OF HELL HARDENS HEARTS and causes others mental anguish.
9. Christianity PROVIDES COVER FOR ABUSES OF ALL KINDS as evidenced by thousands of sexual abuse cases in the last few years alone.
10. Christianity LEGITIMIZES FRAUD as evidenced by countless insincere televangelists and church leaders.
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About Me
- john evans
- See evidence that strongly suggests that the Jesus of the bible was a character fabricated from Old Testament stories! jesusisamyth.blogspot.com
Many men without morals have attacked religion because it was contrary to their inclinations. Many wise men have despised it because it seemed to them ridiculous. Many persons have regarded it with indifference, because they have never felt its true disadvantages. But it is as a citizen that I attack it, because it seems to me harmful to the happiness of the state, hostile to the march of the mind of man, and contrary to sound morality, from which the interests of state policy can never be separated.
~ Baron d'Holbach
~ Baron d'Holbach
27 comments:
I am beginning my study of naturalism with my students today. This video will be a good intro.!
Glad I could help with the class!
Gonna be a beautiful day-have a great one!
The teacher always learns more than the student. As I played this clip this morning, one of the 10th graders in my class pointed out something I failed to realize as I watched at 5:30 this morning.
The ideas presented in the clip are self refuting as they are nothing more than mere musings of another monkey.
Good stuff, and hats off to America's next generation!
You love that term “self refuting”!
Can you please clarify as to what exactly is self refuting in the video?
The ideas in this video self refute on the grounds that the one making it and commenting on all the monkeys is just another monkey. Why is he any more credible than all the other monkeys?
I couldn't believe I missed it, but am very proud of the student who quickly spotted it.
So you are saying that because we evolved rather than being created out of dirt (man) or out of a rib (woman) by a god we therefore cannot reason?
One “monkey” is more credible than the next based on the evidence he brings to the table to support his position. Rather elementary is it not?
No, I am saying that the video is self-refuting.
The monkey who put the video together said nothing about bringing evidence to the table.
I’m not following your thinking. What specifically was said in the video that is erroneous?
You don't follow? : )
This monkey doesn't realize he is a monkey making observations about other monkeys.
It's kind of funny actually!
Of course it is one “monkey”, one person, making observations about another, about the world. How is that self-refuting?
Is it self-refuting for me to say the sun will likely rise tomorrow, or that all evidence points to us as having evolved? Of course not.
I ask you again to give me a specific thing said in the video that is self-refuting, that is wrong.
This is logic 101. I have already illustrated how the whole thing is self refuting. If you're not used to dealing with Logic, the abstract nature of it can be difficult at first. You'll get the hang of it eventually.
As for one thing that's wrong?
You already pointed out something that's wrong. "Technically, we're apes not monkeys."
You are killing me! Monkeys is just funnier sounding than apes. I give up.
but....when I watched I assumed it was NOT another monkey making the comments but another life form from another planet because of the way it was introduced.....and....one day when i had a bizarre opportunity to stand in a grocery store for hours and hours watching the shoppers.....it hit rather strongly as people foraged for food and poked around that we come from Birds and Monkeys(apes if you must)....somehow I believe this with all of me....but maybe i'm just a monkey's uncle. i'll be.
but....when I watched I assumed it was NOT another monkey making the comments but another life form from another planet because of the way it was introduced.....and....one day when i had a bizarre opportunity to stand in a grocery store for hours and hours watching the shoppers.....it hit rather strongly as people foraged for food and poked around that we come from Birds and Monkeys(apes if you must)....somehow I believe this with all of me....but maybe i'm just a monkey's uncle. i'll be.
Fatfish! Is that really you? So nice to have your fishy thoughts grace my goofy blog! Hey I joined facebook yesterday and tried to find you to be my friend ...man that thing is so cool for connecting with people-was like a reunion without having to get dressed up and pay a bunch of money for a ticket! A bit time consuming though!
Homesick, can I point out that logic is linear. This means that one thing leads to the next thought, which leads to the next one, and so on. You are talking in circles by refusing to answer John's question. What is self-refuting, or wrong, in the video? You talk around it, but do not answer the question.
One more thing. Logic is not abstract. It's quite concrete. Logic is sound, linear arguments the build up evidence for a particular viewpoint. You have not used logic at all on this particular comment thread. I really would like to know your critique of this video. I'm fascinated by people who do not believe in evolution; I would like to know what their position is. It's hard to empathize with your position when I do not understand it. You will need to clarify.
I am not talking in circles, I am pointing our that the video creates a circle.
All I am claiming is that the person in the video (another monkey) is telling us why all the other monkeys are really not credible. It self defeats! Why can't you all understand this?
If I told you that I didn't speak english, you would readily see how that statement self defeats.
I didn't say I don't believe in evolution. All that I said is that the concept of the video. One monkey making comments about other monkeys is a classic case of the pot calling the kettle black.
You are right to say that logic is linear. That perfectly illustrates why the video has no logical foundation. It's circular. It all seems to make sense and end the end you are left feeling empty because all the ramblings in the video are just mere musings of another monkey.
As far as evolution goes I would prefer not to use such a broad term. One needs to differentiate between micro and macroevolution. I have no issues with microevolution, but would reject macroevolution.
sooner, I think our minds just work differently. Almost all these little threads end up with me just wanting to scream uncle.
You said “One monkey making comments about other monkeys is a classic case of the pot calling the kettle black.” How so?
Let’s try this:
I am a “monkey” about to make a comment about another “monkey.” So according to you what I am about to say is a classic case of the pot calling the kettle black and self-refuting. Here goes:
“You are a Christian.”
See how un-logical, how un-reasonable your reasoning is?
One more thing. You said “the person in the video (another monkey) is telling us why all the other monkeys are really not credible.”
I think he says we are credible-we are capable, we are smart, we are loving, we are beautiful. We are also delusional, self-destructive, violent animals. The point is we are not specially created beings wholly different from animals and the apple of a sky god’s eye. We are “monkeys” on a tiny speck of a planet amidst a kazillion million billion stars. We must wake up to that fact before we poison the planet beyond repair and or blow it up in the name of some made up god.
The example you give doesn't work. I am a theist evaluating this whole thing from a theistic perspective. Theists don't believe they are mere monkeys. If I believed I was a monkey then your example would work.
So, in terms of value, you see human life no more or no less valuable than a monkeys life, or an ants life, right?
Exactly the point I made way back in my third comment!
According to you only the theist who does not accept the fact of evolution is capable of making statements about the rest of us without “self-refuting” himself.
Wow.
To your ridiculous suggestion that I value an ant’s life as much as my child’s... Yeah, that’s right. I not only “hate” Christians as you have suggested a couple of times now but my wife keeps having to make new babies because whenever I have the fire ant poison out I make a point to sprinkle a good bunch on the kid’s cereal.
For someone that got his panties all bunched up over my “ad hominem” attack of a church father who said women should not be educated you seem to enjoy attacking me. The reason I am so passionate about attacking Christianity is because I love Christians. I love all humanity and I see such belief systems as detrimental to happiness and progress.
I revere life itself, no matter the form it takes. I respect that an ant has the same inherent right to life as a human and understand that causing needless suffering and death to that ant is wicked. This does not mean I value an ant’s life the same as a dog’s life or a human’s life. Even though I am not a smart macro-evolution denying theist such as yourself, i believe i can make reasoned decisions about such things based on a creature’s level of consciousness. I can actually reason that based on our current knowledge of nervous systems and brains my pulling a weed will not cause that life form a great deal of suffering. Pulling the legs off an ant one by one would probably cause suffering to that particular life but few other ants, if any, would likely care. Pulling the legs off a dog would cause that life great suffering but few other dogs aside from any that might watch such a horrific scene would suffer.
Obviously, such a fate for a human would not only be horrific for the individual but could spread suffering throughout the world as we have the biggest network of relationships and the greatest ability to empathize with other’s suffering.
Panties in a bunch? If you'll read my post again I was asking a question.
You said humans are not different from other animals.
I was seeking clarity is all.
I never said you hated Christians, but I did say it seems that way sometimes. I am not pointing that out to try and discredit your worldview thus it wouldn't qualify as an ad hominem.
I would agree with MOST of what you wrote about reverence for life.
But still would like to point out that the video is nothing more than mere musings of another monkey.
John you said:
"The reason I am so passionate about attacking Christianity is because I love Christians. I love all humanity and I see such belief systems as detrimental to happiness and progress."
Don't Christians get a bad rap for having a mentality like this one. I think it's on this basis that Christians are called arrogant and intolerant.
Again, seeking clarity here not attacking.
I think we can find some common ground. I will admit that my rants could reasonably be taken as attacks on believers themselves and I have been guilty of that on occassion as in my mocking quotes of certain high profile Christians. When I call into question the character of the biblegod it is understandable that a believer in said biblegod would feel i was calling their character into question. But let’s put that to rest. My problem is with the bible itself. Christians, as well as Muslims, Mormons, and Scientologists are after all, just fellow “monkeys” so I have great compassion for them.
More common ground: you say “I would agree with MOST of what you wrote about reverence for life.”
Cool!
and
“But still would like to point out that the video is nothing more than mere musings of another monkey.”
Of course it is. I thought he made that clear in the video when he poked fun at the way we revere our great thinkers such as Nietzsche without stopping to think they are just fellow monkeys.
and to your likening my attack of the bible to Christians getting a bad rap for pushing the bible-
I will just say this. The bible tells women they are to be subject to men, it tells men that they may own other men, it tells all of humanity that it is fallen and inherently wicked and deserving of eternal torture to name a few of hundreds of toxic ideas that have poisoned life for 2,000 years. I am not arrogant enough to claim I have knowledge of unknowable things, that there is a god nor intolerant enough to pretend to know he hates homosexuals and women that were men’s clothes or plans to destroy those that eat ham sandwiches or that anyone that addresses his prayers to the wrong god will be tortured forever and ever.
I just want to say “think for yourselves”! Make truth authority, not authority truth. Life is a miracle to be lived fully and fearlessly. Give homosexuals every right heterosexuals claim for themselves. Value women as equals not “help-meets” placed here to serve men. Banish the dark cloud of hell that can’t help but cast a shadow over all of life.
If that makes me intolerant and arrogant so be it.
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